A question for Brits

[xiphias]

Okay. So, I understand that in Great Britain, there is prejudice against redheads. "Ginger" is something of an insult.

Out of curiosity, what are the prejudices that go along with it? What are the prejudicial attitudes that people have of redheads? What personality traits are assumed of redheads that create the prejudice?

In the United States, I would say that there is a mild positive prejudice toward redheads, with redheads seen as passionate, enthusiastic, energetic, and generally dynamic. The potentially negative aspects of this prejudice include an assumed short temper and an assumed sexual adventuresome-ness, and perhaps a little bit of Crazy, but those aren't seen as SERIOUS negative effects, and, in fact, can be seen, by some people, as somewhat positive.

What are the characteristics that are prejudicially associated with redheads in Britain?

Comments

[teddywolf.livejournal.com]

Any possibility that some of it might be associated with lots of Irish redheads and only-recently-quieted tensions with the IRA?

[ailbhe]

Yup, not IRA stuff, much older than that, but it's based in anti-Irish and anti-Scots sentiment.

[papersky.livejournal.com]

Very few Irish people are redhaired, though there is a lot of anti-Irish racism in Britain.

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

I don't see how the actual FACT of not many Irish people having red hair would influence that. Facts are rarely related to prejudices. Most Jews don't have red hair, either, and Jews were associated with red hair, too, for many centuries.

[rosefox]

What personality traits are assumed of redheads that create the prejudice?

I don't think it's about personality at all. It's about race. That's like asking what personality traits are associated with dark skin that lead to white people being biased against darker-skinned people. The bias in question has much less to do with that and much more to do with ethnic tensions.

[nextian.livejournal.com]

But I could give you a long list of made-up personality traits we associate with darker skinned people...? They're made up and they're ex post facto but they exist.

[rosefox]

Oh, sure! I'm just saying that those perceived personality traits don't "create the prejudice"; it's the other way around.

[pierceheart.livejournal.com]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_hair#Gingerism_.28prejudice.2Fdiscrimination_towards_redheads.29

[denimskater.livejournal.com]

Red hair was thought to be a mark of a beastly sexual desire and moral degeneration.

Where do I sign? :-D

It's really kind of strange

[dakiwiboid.livejournal.com]

considering how many members of British royalty have been redheads. Well, maybe that adds to the problem, come to think of it. However, I wonder if British redheads have had an easier time of it during periods when a well-liked redhead wore the crown?

[fatpie42.livejournal.com]

Woah woah woah. I'm not aware of the prejudice against ginger hair being related to race (though historically that may have been the case). It seems more as if it is like the prejudice against baldness or being short. It's not that bald or short people are believed to have certain personality traits or have links with a particular ethnic identity. It's just that they are different and people are mean. (Actually I take that back, short people are often claimed to be angry and hostile to make up for their short stature.)

As for whether ginger is an insult, well when the word is being used as an insult people will often be referred to as "ging-er"s ("ging" rhyming with "ring", followed by "er"). In my experience it's not taken any more seriously than calling someone "short-arse".

[happybat.livejournal.com]

In my classroom and friendship groups, prejudice against redheads is usually directed towards men and children. Most of the female redhaired children I teach dye their hair black. I've heard jokes about not having children because it will spread the 'ginger gene', and jokes that assume red hair is ugly. The personality stuff seems to be more slanted towards redheads have a bad temper.

There is in my experience no association with red hair and Scottishness or Irishness (I currently teach in an area of Scotland that had high levels of Irish immigration in the past, but have seen similar levels of anti redhead prejudice in areas of Scotland that did not have that history) I wonder whether the perception of the red headed Celt is not particularly strong.

Although 'Jock' wigs do have red hair... Hmm...

[ailbhe]

As do the Irish wigs on sale in London on St Patrick's Day.

The anti-Irish anti-Scots thing is absolutely not overt or acknowledged, just a visible root -- a lot of the traits carry over (feistiness/short-temperedness, creativity/unreliability etc). It's very noticeable in fiction, but much more subtle in real life.

[happybat.livejournal.com]

Really? That doesn't seem to mesh with my experience. Maybe just because I am a Scot who lives in Scotland with a whole bunch of other Scots and I see us discriminating in a way that has a lot to do with hair colour, but doesn't seem to be linked in any noticable way at all to 'Scottishness' - most Scots at the moment seem to see that as basically a positive trait. I have always felt that the red headed Scot was a fairly modern American media creation rather than something deeply embedded in the culture.

Equally, I have heard English friends vituperate each other about being 'ginger' in ways that again seemed to have everything to do with hair colour and not much to do with any perceived Scottishness. I would love to be given reasons to reconsider any/all of this, though - has there been work done on this?

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

To throw more confusion into the mix: in Shakespeare's time, a Jew was portrayed with a big, fake nose, and a red wig. Could THAT have anything to do with all this?

[ailbhe]

The character traits presumed for the purposes of mockery to be Irish are largely the same as the ones presumed to be red-headed, plus red-headed children get Irish-accent mockery even when they have English accents themselves, though admittedly I've not seen that nearly as often; most of the red-headed children I have met have been with their parents or people who knew them at the time.

I'm not aware of any studies into anti-Irish sentiment of any kind in the UK. I still experience it.

[embryomystic.livejournal.com]

Although 'Jock' wigs do have red hair... Hmm...

Oh, that's what those things are called. My uncles have them, and I always associate 'Jock' wigs with them singing Donald Where's Your Troosers and other such clowning around.

[baratron.livejournal.com]

What are the characteristics that are prejudicially associated with redheads in Britain?

The only answer I can give to this is "that they have red hair". It's similar to when kids/immature people pick on people who wear glasses, or are fat, or have spots, or freckles. I don't think people who have the prejudice have any idea what they're thinking of, other than that red hair is "different".

Actually, kids who have the combination of red hair and freckles are probably worse off than those without. And if you dare be redhaired, freckled, short-sighted and fat... oh gods.

[ailbhe]

Red hair & freckles is enough to get Oirish accented mockery on the bus, actually. I've seen it happen. (The redheaded kids had English accents when talking to each other).

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

"Fat" goes with "lazy" and "unathletic". "Glasses" goes with "nerd", "socially inept", "uncoordinated." Acne goes with "ugly", "socially inept", and "unhealthy."

And I've never seen anti-freckle prejudice in the United States. So I don't know what would be associated with that.

[houseboatonstyx.livejournal.com]

There was something against redheads in Canada PEI around the 1880s -- Anne Shirley was called "carrots" and her admirers said things like "I don't want to be pretty, I'd rather look like you."

I'll confess an odd prejudice against some redheaded girls and women. They have this gorgeous red curly hair but their faces and clothes and manner indicate strongly that they consider themselves ugly or plain, which makes me react to them as a bit crazy. Maybe I'm wrong, as they often wear that gorgeous hair gorgeously long.

[ailbhe]

LM Montgomery also mocked Irish accents and dialect in her books, though nothing like as much as Gene Stratton-Porter.

[embryomystic.livejournal.com]

We're sexually adventuresome? I mean, yes, but like, that's a hair colour thing? Curious. I got given a hard time as a kid for all sorts of things, including my hair colour, but I never did understand why. I got nothing but positive attention from adults. Women, anyway. And these days the only attention my hair colour gets me is positive.

[hobbitblue.livejournal.com]

I dunno, its not a prejudice I've encountered growing up, and I still tend to parse "he's ginger" as "he's ginger beer = queer" (which means I have to stop and think before responding.. :) )

[papersky.livejournal.com]

Red heads are supposed to be quick-tempered, sexually promiscuous, fickle, treacherous, and lazy -- specifically they're supposed to be apathetic unless aroused to either temper or sex. They're supposed to be bad leaders, unreliable followers and not to be counted on. They're supposed to be sly but also kind of stupid.

I mean I don't know that anybody over ten actually believes this, but this is the stereotype.

And if you think a lot of that also goes with Irish stereotypes, well, yes, so it does.

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

Oddly, the American prejudice has some of the same points -- not lazy, treacherous, apathetic, or stupid, but quick-tempered, promiscuous, and, to a certain extent, fickle -- but it's seen as a GOOD thing.

[rosamund.livejournal.com]

A medieval (possibly older) conceit was that Judas had red hair. (This may have been so painters of The Last Supper could make it immediately clear which disciple he was). Also Eve and Cain have been portrayed with red hair.

The Egyptians and Greeks seem to have thought red hair was unlucky as well. The Romans, I seem to recall, just made wigs of red-headed slaves' hair.

As a redhead who grew up in the US...

[lkw7.livejournal.com]

I have to disagree that there is a positive attitude associated with red hair. I frequently get snarky-negative comments about my temper and ideas from people who don't know me well.