Thoughts on a conversation Lis and I had with a relative tonight. . .

Actually, no, I don't really believe that human nature is perfectable, or even significantly improvable. At least not on the timescale that we're talking. I think that people are motivated today by the same things that they were motivated by a hundred thousand years ago, and, a hundred thousand years from now, they will still be motivated by the same things.

I do rather hope I'm wrong. But it seems to me that there will always be a certain fraction of people who are more motivated by a desire to do good for themselves, and their close kin, than by a desire to do well by the society as a whole. And I think that, if you did create a society in which virtually everybody was motivated primarily by what was best for the society, or the world, as a whole, those people who were motivated by a desire to do well by themselves could game the system well, and amass a disproportionate amount of power.

At which point, no matter what the cosmetic dressing on the outside is, you're still in fundamentally the same position that your high-minded and noble ideas are attempting to change.

There are systems that have been set up to attempt to mitigate this, while working within the constraints of what people really, fundamentally, are. The American Constitution is, in fact, not a bad one. It's just. . . it's rare for such systems to really hold together for more than a couple hundred years at a shot.

I don't really think that we are going to create a lasting societal setup that will do all the things we want it to.

But, y'know, coming up with a system that will make life better for a lot of people for a couple hundred years -- that's a pretty damn good accomplishment. And a worthwhile one.

I just don't think that we'll ever became to come up with a system that will do that for more than a couple hundred years, not until Moshiach comes.

And I do think that the American system, which has worked well so far, is starting to show cracks and top-heavy instability.

It will collapse. And something else will be created. There's actually a pretty good chance that the thing which is created will be pretty good, and may last another couple hundred years. But there's a DAMN good chance that the process of collapse and new creation is going to be incredibly messy and nasty . . .

Lis has made a very good point, every once in a while. One Cassandra realized that nobody was listening to her, what she SHOULD have done was get the fuck out of Troy. You do what you can to save the society, and then, when it's clear that you can't save the society, you just try to get yourself out of the way.

I'm actually reasonably comfortable being part of a species that has wonderful qualities and self-destructive qualities. I don't believe human nature is greatly improvable, and that really doesn't bother me very much. I accept that I have a responsiblity to help the world as a whole, and, when that becomes impossible, to help my society specifically, and, when that fails, to help my friends and family and myself.

I think that a point comes where you just accept that your society is going to come crashing down around you, and you make sure that you and your family aren't there when it happens.

I do, in fact, hope I'm wrong, and I would love it if your ideas about how technology will make people better people were real. I just don't think they are.

Citizenship idea

My father-in-law has mentioned that the questions he had to answer in 1950 when he took his citizenship test were a lot more difficult that the ones in the 1990 version.

I've always thought that it would be an interesting idea to make it so that the ONLY way you could get citizenship was through naturalization. No automatic citizenship because your parents are citizens, or because you're born in the country.

Some time after your eighteenth birthday, you'd have to take a citizenship test in order to become a citizen. If you passed, you'd have to take a citizenship oath or affirmation. Everybody would. (As it is now, I think you can become a citizen before your eighteenth birthday, but I'd like to restrict it so that everyone would have to be eighteen before taking the oath -- I don't think it's fair to expect most little kids to understand an oath.)

You could have citizenship classes in the high schools; you could have big proctored citizenship tests in the schools, like we do the SATs. But I'd probably make the citizenship classes OPTIONAL, and passing the citizenship test would NOT be a requrement for graduation.

You'd have to register for the Selective Service whether you were a citizen or a resident -- that wouldn't change. (Whether having a draft at all is a good idea, or even constitutional, is a different argument.) You'd have to pay the same taxes either way, you'd have the same rights to a lawyer, jury trial, due process, and so forth, whether you were a citizen or not. But you'd only be able to vote, serve on a jury, or serve in elected office, if you were a citizen.

I'd probably make it illegal to discriminate against anybody in hiring or housing or so forth on basis of citizenship. And I'd make it harder to get out of jury duty for any reason except medical hardship. So there would be a cost to being a citizen: you'd have a chance of having to serve on a jury, which would mean that there would be a reason to NOT become a citizen.

If you failed the citizenship test when you were eighteen, or just didn't bother with it, you could take the classes and the test and the oath or affirmation at any time later.

I'd make the citizenship test be reasonably comprehensive -- not incredibly difficult or anything, but you'd have to know something about the way the judicial system works, presumption of innocence, what juries are and why they are, and so forth. You'd probably have to get like an 80% or something to pass -- you could miss a couple questions and still get it.

Anyway, if my father-in-law happens to read this, I'd be really interested if you remember any of the citizenship questions you had to answer. . .

A joke I just made up.

( Who re-roofs the houses of all the good little girls and boys on Christmas Eve? )