You see, THIS is why I care so deeply about language!

[xiphias]

So, being_homeless had a get-together at a Pizzaria Uno in Porter Square, which was fun. But that's not really what I'm going to talk about. While we were there, I ordered a drink. I ordered "Grey Goose vodka, neat."

What I got was "Grey Goose vodka, up."

And it was served in a martini glass.

Okay, I don't mind that last part, really, although I was a little weirded to see that they put it on the bill as a "martini, Grey Goose, neat" (look, I understand that many authorities are accepting the idea that any cocktail served in a martini glass can be called a "martini" -- but I still don't accept the vodka martini as valid, and even the authorities who are willing to call the Cosmopolitan a martini wouldn't say that something with only one ingredient is a mixed drink, which a martini, by any definition, is), but I accept that, because a martini has more booze in it than a shot.

No, the problem was that it was served up, not neat.

"Up" means that you poured it over ice, either stirred or shook, and strained it into a glass. "Neat" means that you poured it into a glass. "Neat" means "room temperature" and "up" means "chilled."

Why would I want to drink the GOOD vodka chilled? Chilling it cuts down the vapors, which cuts down on the nose, and therefore the flavors. And it just generally dulls the taste.

I know this because the vodka tasted better after it warmed up some. Sure, maybe part of that was that the more I drink, the better things taste, but that wasn't all of it -- the last sip, which had finally gotten up to room temperature, was better than the first, ice-cold, one, even allowing for the effects of alcohol.

"Neat", "up." They're different, and they taste different.

Comments

[vonbeck.livejournal.com]

Fundementally you did not get what you ordered.

[vvalkyri.livejournal.com]

So if they brought it to you chilled when youi didn't want it chilled, why not send it back?

OTOH, might they have been keeping it in the fridge/freezer?

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

Because Grey Goose is $40/bottle. If what you get is reasonably close to what you ordered, you usually just take it.

Yeah, the margins at a bar are high enough that remaking a drink won't break anyone, but -- that would involve wasting Grey Goose vodka. Y'know?

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

And yes, they might have been keeping it in the freezer. Which doesn't really change the basic point. . .

[kightp.livejournal.com]

The last time I ran into this problem, I called it to the cashier's attention - and the price of the drink went down. Evidently, at this particular establishment, a shot of unadorned alcohol served in a martini glass is a cocktail, and costs more than the same quantity of the same liquor served in, say, a shot glass.

I'd like to hope that's not a common practice, but if it is, you may have been overcharged.

(I haven't gone back to that bar since.)

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

Ah, but a martini is TWO shots of alcohol.

This is why people order "extra dry martinis" -- it's to get two shots of gin or vermouth for the price of one and a half shots.

[kightp.livejournal.com]

Interesting. That didn't seem to be the case where I was drinking, but you're the bartender. (-:

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

That's what Louis, the bartender who was training me at the Grill Bar told me, after telling me I was making my martinis WAY too small. . .

[red-frog.livejournal.com]

It's a more practical example than mine. ;)

[matociquala.livejournal.com]

It was probably out of the freezer rather than over ice. There's a school of thought that says that the 'proper' way to drink vodka is frozen.

I happen to subscribe to that school of thought, but then, I drink Finlandia or Stoli when I drink wodka, not Grey Goose. (My Ukranian ancestors do enough grave-spinning over my drinking Scandahoovian grain vodka and not that potato swill without my tempting my great-grandfather's spirit to vengeance by paying $40/bottle for it. And I like a little roughness in my vodka, anyway: otherwise I'd stick to my other love, single malt.)

And now I want a drink, dammit.

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

It IS the proper way to drink SOME vodkas.

But not Grey Goose.

And I like a little roughness in my vodka, anyway

Isn't it interesting how we end up prizing qualities in things we love that would normally be thought of as flaws?

[matociquala.livejournal.com]

Isn't it interesting how we end up prizing qualities in things we love that would normally be thought of as flaws?

It is, indeed. Like a crooked nose on somebody you love....

[dadlion.livejournal.com]

with all the potatoes in finland i would have expected finlandia to be potato based. but i guess that would lower it some.

[matociquala.livejournal.com]

Finlandia's surprisingly nice stuff for the price. Not sticky-sweet like Absolut, and Cranberry Finlandia is...

...ummm.

Pass the limes, would you?

[dadlion.livejournal.com]

grin

best i have had (well gray goose is nice) was some special stoli that you can't get in the US. my ex's cousin work lives in Moscow brought it to a family wedding.

[rmjwell.livejournal.com]

Maybe he was a reform mixologist?

[g,d,r]

[wordweaverlynn.livejournal.com]

Now there's a distinction I did not know. Next time, I'll have to order Wild Turkey neat instead of straight up. Nobody ever has Rebel Yell, which I prefer.

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

Well, you'll notice that most bartenders key off of the alcohol more than the actual term. Mostly, if you order whiskey neat, you get it neat. If you order it up, you tend to get it neat. If you order it on the rocks, you get it on the rocks. But nobody drinks whiskey up, so bartenders don't serve it that way.

Me, I'm annoying, and will actually ASK if people actually want it up or neat.

[matociquala.livejournal.com]

Is that "annoying" as in "good at your job"?

[dadlion.livejournal.com]

but youre a real BARTENDER - most are just looking for pickups

[angelovernh.livejournal.com]

Ok, keep in mind that this was from a Pizzeria Uno, where most likely the bar tenders are not quite as pro, skilled, nor as talented as you and the establishment you work at. Nor are they probably paid or tipped as well..

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

I'm not tipped at all. . . no tipping policy at the club. :)

[sinboy.livejournal.com]

This is why someone of your level of skill is at your club, and Unos gets someone of lesser skill. Sure you could do the job better, but working ther would probably drive you nuts. I'm betting your work environment is more classy, and probably more fun.

As for Vodka, I like Belvedere. It tastes good. I do keep it cold, but mostly for martinis. I'm not as experienced a drinker as most, though. It might be crap for all I know. Some people think starbucks is beyond acceptable, and is really good coffee. I don't judge them. They just haven't gotten into coffee like I have.

And finaly, what sort of glass would you suggest serving quality vodka in at room temperature? I shouldn't ask. I already like expensive whiskey, brandy, champagne and wine (ice wine!).

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

I'm not a very skilled bartender. Yet. What I am is a geek and a pedant, and I take my geekery and pedantry with me to everything I do. That means that, although I'm not very skilled to start, I am motivated to become very good.

[goljerp]

Joy did last Thursday's New York Times crossword puzzle. After she finished, she mentioned to me, "I know this answer's correct, but I don't know why." The clue was "The opposite of neat", and the answer was "on ice". I surprised myself by knowing that "neat" was a drink term, meaning something like "without ice", but I thought it was synonomous with "straight up". I guess it's more complicated than that.

"Up" means that you poured it over ice, either stirred or shook, and strained it into a glass. "Neat" means that you poured it into a glass. "Neat" means "room temperature" and "up" means "chilled."

As far as value goes, I'd expect "Up" to be cheaper for the bar, since if the vodka started at room temperature (20 degrees C), it would melt a bit of the ice while cooling down to 0 degrees C. It's too late for me to calculate the amount of ice which would melt when 118 mL (4 oz) of liquid (80% by volume ethanol, 20% water - is that correct?) is cooled to 0 C, and what the resulting volume change would be (30 ml ethanol + 70 ml water don't equal 100 ml -- at 25 degrees celcius, the total volume in this example is 97.3 ml.[1]) But, maybe the amount of icemelt isn't very large. Also, I think that water and ethanol both become more dense as they cool down (although of course once water changes phase to ice it becomes less dense), so it's probably a wash as far as the bar is concerned. Also, from Xiphius's comments, the vodka probably wasn't that diluted by the ice.

[1] P.W. Atkins, Physical Chemistry 3rd Edition, example problem, Pg. 162. I told you it was too late for me to do calculations!

[copperpoint.livejournal.com]

I was at a Laphroaig Sponsored event in boston back in october. And I had a fun moment with Bill Burgess, the head distiller, when someone ordered a Laphroaig on the rocks and we launched into a lengthly discussion on the merits of neat-ness.

[teddywolf.livejournal.com]

BTW, the Bugaboo Creek in Watertown seems to have Grey Goose.

[roadnotes.livejournal.com]

Interesting: I accept the vodka martini, but REFUSE to refer to anything that has more than two ingredients (one being vermouth) as a "martini" -- for some reason, the concept makes me excessively cranky. (If I put gin and vermouth, or vodka and vermouth, in a baby bottle, does that make it "formula"?)

Just a cranky datapoint.

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

Hmm. . .

Just for fun, I'm going to argue the other side of this than I usually argue. :)

Until almost 1950, the martini usually included orange bitters. And the "Martinez", possibly the earliest martini, was Old Tom gin (which is sweeter than modern gin), SWEET vermouth, marachino liquer, and bitters.

For me, I'm willing to include bitters in a martini recipe, but I'm not sure whether the Marinez is a martini.